Q&A: High Intensity Training For Martial Artists

Question:

I get a lot of questions about high intensity training from martial artists, but the things they ask most often are;

How can I do both high intensity training and study martial arts without overtraining?

What exercises should I do to improve my ability to strike, kick, throw, etc.?

Do I need to lift weights explosively to improve power?

Will strength training slow me down or reduce my flexibility?

Answer:

The volume and frequency of exercise necessary to avoid overtraining while also regularly practicing martial arts depends on how hard, how long, and how often you practice, as well as your body’s response to exercise. Unless you are doing a lot of very demanding drilling, sparring, or grappling practicing the martial arts for a few hours a few days a week is unlikely to negatively effect recovery between workouts. However, if you are doing hours of very demanding practice every week, you may have to reduce the frequency of either your workouts or practice to avoid overtraining.

First, you need to determine which is the higher priority. If you compete in bodybuilding or strength sports, or if you are relatively weak or in poor condition your workouts should be prioritized and your martial arts training should be structured around your workout schedule. If you are already relatively strong and in good condition and skill in the martial arts is important to you or essential to your work, your martial arts training should be prioritized and your workouts structured around your practice schedule.

If you have failed to make significant progress in your workouts for more than a few weeks, or if you are unable to perform well during martial arts practice due to fatigue, take a week off from workouts and hard martial arts training to completely recover (light drills, forms, sparring are fine) then reduce the frequency of either your workouts or your martial arts practice depending on which is currently the higher priority.

Bruce Lee performing barbell curls

Like any sensible workout program, an exercise program for martial artists should cover all the major muscle groups, but special attention should be paid to training the muscles of the neck, grip, and forearms, and trunk. Stronger neck muscles can withstand more force and prevent your head from moving as rapidly when struck, allow you to better resist neck cranks, and allow you to head-butt more forcefully. Stronger grip and forearms help with wrist stability when striking, maintaining a secure grip on an opponent or weapon, and resisting manipulation of your hands and/or wrists. A stronger trunk improves transmission of power between your lower and upper body, and protects your internal organs better when struck. For examples see High Intensity Workouts.

It is neither necessary nor beneficial to perform exercises that mimic striking, kicking, throwing, or other martial arts skills, or to perform these skills while holding or wearing weights or elastic bands. Doing so does not improve power in the movement being mimicked any better than conventional exercises involving the same muscle groups, and can even negatively effect the skill. Basic, conventional exercises performed with barbells, bodyweight, or machines will improve strength and power more effectively and safely without negative transfer of skill.

Chuck Norris performing dumbbell bench presses

It is not necessary to lift weights explosively to improve power. As long as you are getting stronger and the force your muscles are capable of producing is increasing your power will increase as well. You can get stronger training very fast, very slow, or with isometric protocols involving no movement at all, as long as you are working hard, progressively, and consistently, however moving more slowly during exercise is easier on your joints and reduces your risk of injury.

The only time you have to move explosively is when practicing the skills you want to improve explosiveness in, after having learned and practiced the correct body mechanics. Move slowly when exercising, quickly when practicing martial arts.

Strength training didn't reduce Jean Claude Van Damme's flexibility

Strength training will not make you slower or reduce your flexibility. The stronger your muscles are, the more force they can produce, the faster you can accelerate when performing any movement. Strengthening a muscle does not reduce it’s flexibility, and can actually improve flexibility when done through a full range of motion or in conjunction with a regular stretching program. I have practiced various martial arts since I was eleven years old, and have strength trained regularly since I was thirteen years old, and until I stopped stretching on a regular basis I was able to easily perform full front and side splits and kick almost straight up.

Drew Baye's best Jean Claude Van Damme immitation

While strength training alone will improve flexibility in someone who has poor flexibility, someone who already has above average flexibility would require supplemental stretching to improve it further. Stretching should be done gradually, and in a manner that stretches the muscles rather than the connective tissue or joints. The best approach, in my opinion, is to perform stretches in a position that does not put the muscles being stretched under load, if possible. For example, a seated hamstring or calf stretch is better than a standing one. This may not be possible for some movements like side splits, however. When you stretch only move until you begin to feel the stretch in the target muscles, then hold that position until they relax. Once the muscles relax, gradually move further until you begin to feel the stretch again, then hold that position until they relax or for around thirty seconds, whichever is longer. This can be done daily. If you want to combine your stretching with your workouts on workout days, perform it after rather than before your workouts.

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  • Steven Siemons Dec 16, 2014 @ 8:51

    Good advice. With weightlifting having always been my favorite, when I studied Shotokan, the intensity of the workouts was one important factor in greatly reducing my lifting activities. It was a totally different emphasis that was a major challenge to me on many levels. I made the decision, for a four year period, to focus entirely on the martial art. In my 60`s now, both forms of training are a part of my routine.

    The Senior Health and Fitness Blog

    • Drew Baye Dec 16, 2014 @ 10:19

      Hey Steven,

      Most of the martial artists I train or consult cut their workouts back rather than their martial arts practice, and this seems to work best. You can reduce workout frequency significantly and still make good progress, some times better progress with more recovery time, but if you reduce practice frequency too much it negatively effects skill progression. The only time I would recommend reducing martial arts practice instead of workout frequency is if a person is very weak and deconditioned and would benefit more from improving their strength and conditioning.

  • robyn bunting Dec 16, 2014 @ 9:29

    How do you use strength training in such a way as to avoid being pushed up out of you weight class?

    Is there a way to determine one’s optimum weight class?

    • Drew Baye Dec 16, 2014 @ 10:14

      Hey Robyn,

      There is no way to predict exactly how much muscle someone will be able to gain since the ratio of strength gains to muscle hypertrophy varies a lot between individuals, so it is impossible to determine the optimum weight class for someone in the long run, but in the short term your optimum weight class is the one that allows you to carry the most muscle and least fat and perform your best. If you are already very lean you should not try to go down a weight class because doing so would require sacrificing muscle and negatively effect performance. If you are carrying a lot of bodyfat leaning down to get to a lower weight class should be your first priority, then once you’ve leaned down focus on gaining muscle. If you are able to gain enough muscle to move up a weight class while staying lean you should do fine in that weight class.

      Of course, there may be strategic reasons to want to move to another weight class which may outweigh these, such as wanting to move into a weight class with fewer competitors, or if your school or gym needs more people to represent them in that weight class.

  • James Dec 16, 2014 @ 21:26

    Drew,

    Can Robyn still maintain high intensity protocol regarding volume but change his rep choice to a lower number to affect more him in a more neural fashion for strength and not so much for hypertrophy so he doesn’t gain too much weight?

  • robyn bunting Dec 17, 2014 @ 11:00

    Dear Drew, I thank you very much for your comments but I think they miss some essentials, the main one being the power to weight ratio of one‘s opponents at a given weight-this will very rarely be ” the one that allows you to carry the most muscle and least fat.” In fact, it will rarely be the case, without regard for opponents, that a maximum muscle, minimum fat state would allow one to “perform your best.”
    This is as far as I have gotten with this question-I am a former competitive amateur boxer, keen boxing fan and practising martial artist [albeit on a long lay off after a fall seriously hurt my ankle requiring a tendon graft].
    I have identified two factors that bear on this question-
    1. Power to weight ratio
    2.The relationship between VO2max and lean bodyweight.
    [A useful paper on this is „Influence of Body Composition on the Dimensions of VO2 max“. Jaswant Singh Thakur*, 2Ramesh Chand Yadav and 3Vivek Kr. Singh]

    Also, Beekley, M., Abe, T., Kondo, M., Midorikawa, T. and Yamauchi. T. (2006) Comparison of normalized maximum aerobic capacity and body composition of sumo wrestlers to athletes in combat and other sports. Journal of Sports Science and Medicine CSSI, 13-20

    First, power to weight ratio. These are actual numbers that I have logged from my first day of weight training at the age of 14.
    When I was 60 kilos I could bench 70 kilos.
    When I was 70 kilos I could bench 90 kilos.
    When I was 80 kilos I could bench 110 kilos.
    When I was 95 kilos I could bench 115 kilos
    When I was 107 kilos I could bench 120 kilos.

    That is the bigger I got the stronger i got, but not commensurately, with my maximum PWR peaking around 80 kilos bw. 110/80=1.38.

    Now its often said that a fighter cant take their punch up with them in weight. I think they can, actually hitting harder for each increase in bw. [I assume bench press is a reasonable proxy for punching power].The problem is that they can’t do this proportionately. For example, If i fought at 80 and then moved up to 105kilos, purely due to scientific weight training, my pwr would drop from 1.38 to 1.12 but at 105 I would be fighting at least some opponents who would be naturally at the their peak pwr and who would outgun me considerably. I think there is ample empirical evidence for this phenomenon in the sharp drop in knockouts for fighters who move up substantially. I suspect such fighters also find themselves getting knocked out more often also.
    So this suggests that a fighter optimises strength training and muscle mass by finding the weight that maximizes pwr, not absolute highest strength and lean body weight.

    Secondly relationship between VO2 max and lean bodyweight-the paper above indicates that VO2 max rises with lean body weight but only up to a point. Most athletes can only improve their Vo2 max by about 15-20% no matter what they do and getting this gain usually requires a very little extra muscle. But after this point their Vo2 max per kilo of LBW starts to go down. If this was the only factor the optimum weight for a fighter is at the peak Vo2max per kilo of LBW. Lets say that is 50 ml/kg(LBM)/min. I suggest in most cases that that amount of LBW would be well below what is the maximum possible for the fighter. In an ideal world, the fighter wants a vo2max/lbw as high as possible because

    “since muscle takes significant amounts of energy to cool and carry there is a point of diminishing returns when it comes to an aerobic athlete building muscle.”

    But its not the only factor-at a minimum, PWR is one other. So, maximising for Vo2 max is likely to be too light as the fighter sacrifices power and maximizing for PWR is likely to be too heavy for a fighter, sacrificing stamina.

    So what is the optimum fighting weight? I suggest the factor to maximise is the PRODUCT of PWR and VOMax/LBW, not either on their own.

    I also know from traing records my peak VO2max/LBW was hit at 65 kilos bw when I had a LBW of about 58 kilos and a VO2max of 70 so a vo2max/lbw of 1.2. But my PWR was only around 1.15 giving a product [1.2*1.15] of 1.38.

    At 80 kilos though I had a pwr of 1.38* VO2M/LBW of 1.13=1.56. Because both factors would diminish with added bodyweight i know my optimum weight is 80 kilos at the most and would probably have been around 75kilos.

    In fact, regardless of competition, this might be the optimum weight for me as a martial artist if I make the assumption that I would not be able to blow out a street opponent immediately or very quickly and therefore need to hedge between raw power and endurance.

    Anyway, those are my thoughts. Comments?

    • Drew Baye Dec 22, 2014 @ 14:13

      Hey Robyn,

      Power increases proportional to strength, and strength and hypertrophy increase proportionally (after the initial neural adaptations), so the more muscle a person has relative to their bodyweight, the more powerful they will be. VO2max is not a reliable indicator of fitness and I wouldn’t give it any consideration. The following on VO2max is from an article by Ken Hutchins in an issue of The Exercise Standard covering various fitness testing procedures:

      “Most fitness testing involves tools and methods taken from other, more-proper disciplines. For instance, the Beckman cart was originally intended to measure VO2Min (minimum volume of oxygen) to assess basal metabolism in comatose patients. It was not intended as a performance test as VO2Max (maximum volume of oxygen). (Note that performance is nil with a comatose patient.) Regarding this, please refer to The Nautilus Book by Ellington Darden, PhD. Therein are sections where Keith Johnson, MD, criticizes VO2Max testing as inappropriate. I met with Dr. Johnson in the summer of 1992 and asked him if he had changed his views regarding such testing. He emphasized that The Nautilus Book references were accurate and current.

      For VO2Max testing to be seriously attempted, a seal must be maintained between the air exchange of the subject and the Beckman Cart. There exists an unavoidable error of calibration for the gases in the hoses between subject and Beckman Cart. To keep this error at a minimum and constant, only steady state activity is reasonably tested. This permits use of short hoses to minimize the volume (dead space) of the gases between the subject and the Beckman Cart.

      For instance, if a full Nautilus circuit is to be used, the hoses and cart would be required to follow the subject along the circuit. In addition to this inconvenience, the hoses might preclude several key Nautilus exercises due to hose interference. And if such interference could be avoided, special consideration to redirect the hoses or change their orientation with each exercise would greatly compromise the exercise intensity. This explains why exercise physiologists are typically adamant regarding the need for steady state activity to serve as exercise. It is the only activity that lends itself to be tested by their test.

      Equine Maximal Oxygen Uptake Testing

      Note the picture above. As oxygen consumption is measured, a horse is running on a treadmill as is assumably required if measuring equipment is applied to a horse. Either the equipment must go with the horse or the horse must be tethered to the equipment. Either way, steady state activity remains imperative for testing. Consider the fact that it is not possible to teach a horse or another animal subject to perform movements according to muscle/joint function. It must be tested in its typical mode of locomotion. It becomes only natural that exercise physiologists become trapped in a mindset of locomotive behavior for testing purposes.

      The use of treadmills originated with the use of draft animals ? including humans ? for the purpose of supplying power to drive industrial machinery. I do not know if oxygen consumption measurement originated with the application to other animals or if it was first used on humans, then applied to horses and other animals. The general practice of such measurement seems to have been around since the 1920s. Its use was the result of earlier work by in 1907. These origins are detailed somewhat by D. J Sharkey in New Dimensions in Aerobic Fitness. [Note that the title of Sharkey’s book uses the proper biochemical adjective aerobic without an s to imply the legitimacy and emphasis of the aerobic metabolic pathway as the only exercise importance, although the exercise physiology stance actually resides in the pop culture perversion of aerobics – Ken Cooper’s slang that includes the s. I attempt to apply these variations consistently in my writings.]

      With human subjects, another approach might be to avoid hoses altogether by placing the subject and several exercise machines in an airtight bubble. Although this would facilitate the freedom of movement for more ideal exercise, the dead space error would be enormous and unmanageable.

      We further assume that the testing equipment is properly cleaned and calibrated. Dr. Johnson originally doubted the precision of the uptake testing equipment until he found that proper calibration rendered a reliable tool. However, he hedges that most physiologists do not adequately maintain their equipment or appreciate the need to do so.

      Ellington Darden states that accurately testing oxygen consumption in any activity other than treadmills or something akin to stationary bicycles is like “trying to type while riding a stage coach.”

      Assuming an accurate test is possible, attempts to make something of VO2Max testing are unsuccessful. According to Darden, no one has found a disease or condition that VO2Max detects, qualifies, or quantifies. According to Darden, VO2Max is a test looking for a problem to measure.

      On January 13, 1995, Michael Pollock, PhD, admitted to Ellington Darden that VO2Max testing is no test of anything and almost totally a genetically dependent variable. This is outrageous since Pollock, more than Kenneth Cooper or any other one person, has done more work in this country to set up exercise physiology degree programs, certification programs with the American College of Sports Medicine, and cardiac rehabilitation programs with VO2Max testing as its basis. This has resulted in the present $3 billion fitness industry.

      VO2Max is now documented to be almost completely genetic and can vary only slightly due to training effect (exactly what Keith Johnson asserted). A Klissouras, V. was the first name on ?Heredibility of Adaptive Variation? in the Journal of Applied Physiology (Vol.31, No. 3 pp. 338-344, 1971) as well as ?Genetic Limits of Functional Adaptability? in Int. Z Angew Physiology (Vol. 30, pp. 85-94, 1972). In these papers, and over 20 years ago, Klissouras documented that VO2Max is 93.4% genetically determined in males and 95.9% genetically determined in males and females together. The fact that we can expect only a 4-6% improvement due to environmental control strongly suggests that VO2Max, if a reliable test, is not an appropriate test to study human health.

      Other authorities condemn the futility of VO2Max testing. Ted Lambrinedes, PhD and George Sheehan, MD (cardiologist) have made bountiful arguments against it.

      Brian J. Sharkey, PhD, (New Dimensions in Aerobic Fitness, ? 1991) elaborates many of the inconsistencies of VO2Max testing, but then hedges his conclusions as if to stretch a rationalization for its practice. He admits that his attitude toward VO2Max has gone from extreme belief in the test to confused disappointment since the beginning of his 30-year career. His arguments seem to be organized along a line of cardiovascular fitness: staying well clear of using it to denote health. Sharkey also makes a plea for tests that are more specific to the activity performed. Here is a case of an exercise physiologist who seems to approach the subject reasonably, but fails to apply the principles of motor learning, the six factors of functional ability, the Exercise vs Recreation argument, or The First Definition of Exercise.

      A more extreme stretch is made when – in the absence of a Beckman Cart – VO2Max is measured indirectly with a bicycle ergometer based on a protocol that correlates performance (metabolic work units termed metabolic equivalents => Mets) on the bicycle to oxygen consumed (Mets) with a known VO2Max calibration. Since metabolic work can not be measured – a la Arthur – this is horribly sloppy, although widely accepted and taught in exercise physiology and certification courses. (Note that the word ergometry implies that metabolic work can be measured.)

      In The Exercise Myth (? 1984) cardiologist Henry Solomon states that Columbia University cardiologist Jonathan Moldover “denies there is such a thing as cardiovascular fitness, because fitness is related to peripheral changes.” Corollary to this testing issue, Solomon states that there is no correlation between cardiovascular fitness and cardiovascular health. He also notes that the presumed development of protective collateral coronary arterial supply due to exercise is just as likely due to the stimulus of a survived heart attack.

      In the 1970s Arthur Jones admitted that he knew little or nothing about the validity of VO2 testing equipment. He then qualified his admission further with statements to the effect, “but I am aware of the gross inaccuracies of the tools used to measure strength. And since the same kind of fools who developed the strength testing equipment also were the same kind of fools that developed VO2 testing, what can I safely assume?”

  • Bryce Dec 20, 2014 @ 23:08

    Drew,

    Why did you stop stretching? Did you feel the extra flexibility you had wasn’t worth the effort? How time consuming was it to attain and maintain that level of mobility, and how much of it have you lost? If a previous post answers all these things, I’d appreciate a push in the right direction.

    • Drew Baye Dec 22, 2014 @ 14:02

      Hey Bryce,

      I used to stretch prior to practicing kicks or forms, and when I was the most flexible I was practicing obsessively, often for two to three hours once or twice a day. I got too busy with school and work and cut way back. After moving to Florida I rarely practiced for a few years until finding a Jeet Kune Do school. Once I started again, the flexibility came back very quickly. Despite not having stretched much recently, I can still put my palms flat on the ground with my knees straight (having long arms, short legs, and six lumbar vertebrae instead of five helps) but when performing a side split I can only abduct each hip around forty five to fifty degrees rather than close to ninety like I could then.

      I am already way behind on my current book projects, but if there is enough interest I will write something specifically on training for martial artists, including both workout and stretching programs when those are finished.

  • Trace Dec 30, 2014 @ 13:53

    It’s also worth noting that one of the Six Factors of Functional ability is “flexibility” – which is one of the four factors that are trainable. But this does not necessarily mean that everyone should try to “increase” their flexibility since this approach may be contraindicated for many people with joint and tendon issues. Adequate flexibiltiy for daily functional activities is achieved primarily by improving strength. The limits of someone’s flexibility is determined by one’s level of flexibility – and as you said – this level also depends on one’s bodily proportions which are “genetically dictated.”

    • Drew Baye Dec 31, 2014 @ 12:47

      Hey Trace,

      This is correct, adequate flexibility for daily functional activities is achieved primarily by improving strength, however for those who desire extreme flexibility for some styles of martial arts stretching would be required. This might not be healthy for some individuals, however.

      In high school and earlier in college I both stretched and practiced high kicking obsessively, and it has taken it’s toll on my hips. These days I do not practice any kicks higher than waist height, both for my hips, and because my primary goal is self defense, not sport fighting, and high kicks are not practical in most situations.

  • Steven Turner Jan 1, 2015 @ 22:51

    Hi Drew,

    This might be a bit off topic but I had an intersting conversation with a scientist who is conducting research into balance and aging. Not that I understand all the complexities of balance, I will therefore best describe our conversation in my own words of understanding. I asked him about the fitness industry and all this obsession with “balance training” simply he laughed. But said that the balance training that he as observed in the fitness industry can in fact make the “balance” situation for many people worse. Essentially what he told me is that for most people everyday balance requirements that there is no need for any further training – so much for functional movement training. If someone has balance problems it is in the inner ear “vestibular dysfunction” that it is a neuron deficit that can’t be fixed with training on unbalanced surfaces. If someone does have vestibular dysfunction putting that person into unfamilar balanced positions -swiss balls can potentially cause serious injuries to the person. I presume that diagnosis of vestibular dysfunction would require a “specilaist”.

    He confirmed and as you have said on many occassions that balance is specific to the the task and that there is skill involved in learning to balance in specific skills. For example a dancer who spins will require to focus their eyes on a spot whilst they are spinning to maintain their balance.

    In the near future I am going to meet him in his laboratory so that he can show me his research and more specifically how balance works. But he did say that neuron signalling problem in the vestibular ear that you would loose your balance before you could stop yourself from falling. With the aging the research that they have conducted so far hasn’t confirmed that the neuron signaling is associated with aging.

    He did say that strength training would be his advise for people to keep doing.

    • Drew Baye Jan 2, 2015 @ 12:48

      Hey Steven,

      Thanks for sharing, and please let us know what you learn when you visit his lab!

  • Chris Jan 2, 2015 @ 1:18

    Being a hit Devotie I would never underestimate the benefits from proper strength training. Bigger stronger muscles make everything easier. Should be no question about that. That being said, strength training for martial arts really only truly apply to sport fighting competition based systems. Real actual violence rarely last more than 10 seconds. Physical conditioning is simply not necessary to be successful in a true act of street violence. The intent to cause a real injury to someone is however required. Stabbing someone in the liver eight times or hitting them over the head with a tire iron does not require large muscles just the intent to do so

    • Drew Baye Jan 2, 2015 @ 12:46

      Hey Chris,

      Real violence usually starts and ends quickly, but not always, and while physical conditioning may not be not necessary in some situations, in many situations it can be helpful, even when weapons are involved. Your ability to move, either to get off the line, get to cover, or counter, depends on your physical conditioning.

      Due to bad decisions I made when I was younger I’ve been in multiple situations involving use of force where my conditioning absolutely made a difference. Three in particular come to mind.

      In the first, a friend was attacked by someone who outweighed each of us by a considerable amount. When I stepped in he took me to the ground, most likely with the intent of a “ground and pound”. I was able to punch him in the throat, at which point he attempted to roll off to the side and disengage, and I rolled after him putting him in a choke. I believed if I did not put him out at least long enough for us to leave he would continue the attack. Although he was already having difficulty breathing after being punched in the throat he still had a lot of fight in him, and it took some work to get the choke. It took much longer than it should have to choke him out, and the entire time he was thrashing around, elbowing me, trying to hit me with his head, etc. (it probably didn’t help that I kept whispering I was going to kill him). By the time he passed out I was more exhausted than I have ever been in my life. Had I not been in good physical condition I may not have been able to get the choke and hold it long enough and he may have gotten back to his feet. I was unaware at the time that his trachea had swollen shut and he probably would not have been able to continue.

      Fortunately, the ambulance got there in time for him, and all the witnesses were friends of mine and the victim of the initial attack, so there were no charges.

      In the second I was attacked by a middleweight boxer leaving a party. I was sucker punched, then kicked repeatedly while on the ground and getting up. Despite this, I was able to beat him badly enough to send him to the hospital. Had I not been in good physical condition I suspect the outcomes might have been reversed, as this person had a reputation for seriously hurting people. I learned later he had broken someone’s jaw in a fight the week before.

      The third happened long before these, when I was thirteen. I was hanging out at a local teen center with friends one night when an angry, drunken high school kid started threatening me, apparently because of an earlier incident involving his younger brother. He was a senior at the time, and much larger and presumably stronger than I was. He started threatening to cut me, at which point I turned to tell a friend we were getting out of there. As I did, he grabbed my jaw with his left hand, turning my head back towards him while simultaneously reaching for his pocket. I hit him in the face, causing him to stumble, then continued to punch him as he fell back onto the ground, at which point I kicked and stomped him until the teen center’s security people came out and pulled me off of him. Fortunately, I had already been strength training regularly and was reasonably strong for my age, otherwise that first hit might not have been so effective, and the outcome may have been much worse.

      So, in my experience with physical violence, of which this is only a small fraction, physical conditioning does make a difference.

      Violence is a continuum, and there are a lot of points along that continuum where physical conditioning does make a difference, even when lethal weapons are involved, since movement is still important. In any case, considering what is at risk I think people should try to gain any advantage they can, and having a high level of strength and conditioning can be an advantage in many situations.

  • Chris Jan 2, 2015 @ 14:16

    That’s fair enough The Place I come from our definition of real violence is when an objective real injury occurs that is something a radiologist could look at in an x-ray or an MRI and say, yeah that’s not gonna work anymore Anything that happens before that point really isn’t violence and certainly not what we would call it injury there may be a lot of yelling and screaming and pushing grabbing rolling around on the ground but that really isn’t violence So if you’re going to roll around on the ground with somebody or exchange punches with them or something in between that, then yes you certainly need to be well Conditioned, otherwise you’re going to be gassed in about five seconds Butt kicking someone in the groining in order to rupture their testicles and then grabbing the back of their head so they can’t get away as you ram your thumb as far as you can into their eyesocket really doesn’t require any physical conditioning whatsoever just the offenseive mindset,that is the will to do it. Our prisons are full of people who are really really good at doing violence to other people unfortunately most of them are not in very good shape at all many of which are drug addicted people who have little strength or physical conditioning and no martial arts background whatsoever. But I agree with you as far leading up to the actual act of violence physical conditioning can make all the difference in the world for that

    • Drew Baye Jan 2, 2015 @ 15:48

      Chris,

      Ending violence quickly is the ideal, but it might not always be possible, and there are some situations where the level of force required is less than the damage caused by these kind of techniques, but high enough to require significant physical effort, such as when you want to control a large, strong, and possibly drunk or drugged individual without causing harm.

      Like I said before, violence is a continuum. It doesn’t start when the level of force reaches a certain point, it starts when threats or force begin, regardless of the level they begin at. If you respond with too little force, you’re going to get hurt, or worse. If you respond with too much force, you’re going to have problems with the law. You have to be able to scale your force based on the threat, and this can often mean significant physical exertion. For more on this I very strongly recommend reading Marc MacYoung’s book In the Name of Self-Defense: What it costs. When it’s worth it, and Rory Miller’s book Scaling Force: Dynamic Decision Making Under Threat of Violence.

  • Josh Feb 23, 2016 @ 13:49

    Drew,
    I practice Muay Thai 3 days weekly for 60 non stop minutes per session.
    Safe to assume that 2 full body strength training sessions per week of 30-45 minutes tops would enhance strength and muscle gain?
    I do a 20 minute stretching workout 5 mornings per week to stay loose.

    • Drew Baye Feb 25, 2016 @ 15:31

      Hey Josh,

      Two full body workouts per week is a good starting point for most people, but the volume and frequency that works best varies between individuals. If you’re training hard enough and keeping your rest between exercises short twenty to thirty minutes is more than enough to effectively train all the major muscle groups.

  • Steve Grogan May 25, 2020 @ 14:15

    Great article. I deal with a lot of kickback from practitioners in my style (more so than most martial artists do) because the style I practice (Wing Chun Kung Fu) is all about sensitivity and being able to relax when we engage in a drill called “Chi Sao.” I have had more than one instructor tell me, “Be careful of that weightlifting, Steve. You won’t be able to relax during Chi Sao.” This has always struck me as ridiculous. In fact, I even did an interview with my personal trainer so he could explain HOW it’s nonsense:

    https://youtu.be/lkCtlITaJTc

    • Drew Baye May 25, 2020 @ 16:51

      Hey Steve, this has been my experience as well. I’ve trained in a few martial arts including Wing Chun and proper strength training only improves your ability to practice and perform these.

      • Steve Grogan May 29, 2020 @ 8:10

        Drew,

        I agree. I feel like my performance has gotten better ever since getting into HIT. MY trainer Jay Primarolo said he also contacted you about this. I believe your reply was that some of these Wing Chun teachers say weightlifting will make you tense because they work with students who lift, and those students have a tendency to rely on their muscle to overpower instead of remembering to relax. I am paraphrasing HIS paraphrase of you, but if that is close to what you said, then that certainly makes sense to me. I can see how having more muscle would make you lean toward relying on it instead of being relaxed still.